[Update : June 18 : The gig as a whole has since been CANCELLED.]
On Friday June 22, Sydney-based hardcore/punk label Snapshot Records is organising a gig by some of its bands. They are:
On Friday July 6, CMYK Love, Hey, That’s My Bike and The Dank are performing.
In addition to releasing albums, Snapshot Records also sells music by the sea shore, including, notably, neo-Nazi muzak, by the likes of Blood Red Eagle (AUS), Bound For Glory (UK not US), Fortress (AUS), Legion of St. George* (UK), Retaliator (UK), Skrewdriver (UK) and the incomparable Southern Storm (“Niggers, Jews and Communists / Look out scum, you’re on our list!”). This renders Snapshot, along with Melbourne-based Deadset Music and Sydney-based Scythian Services, among the most prominent of RAC online distros Down Under.
- Deadshit Muzak stocks an even larger range of fascist / neo-Nazi / RAC and white power music, including but not limited to Antagon, Battle Scarred, Condemned 84, Combat 84, Crashed Out, D.A., Get Out, The Gits, Hateful, Kampfzone, Knockdown, Marching On, Retaliator, Tattooed Motherfuckers and Unit Lost.
Well, that’s Sydney hardcore for you. What’s especially odd about Jay’s flogging fascist shit, however, is Snapshot’s claimed affiliation to Class War(!). And while I kinda doubt Darren has experienced a radical shift in his politics, the London-based group makes its opinion regarding Blood & Honour and other such filth very clear, I think, by including the image below on their site. And a picture is worth a thousand words. Or in this case, just eight: ‘Someone forgot, I’m one of the ‘master-race’.
*The original Legion of St. George, later known as the British Free Corps (Britisches Freikorps), was formed by the German SS from several dozen British POW volunteers in 1943, and was as successful as it was appealing, disbanding not long after. The inspiration for the unit came from an upper class twit called John Amery, who was hanged for treason after the war ended. Oddly enough, the only British officer to have joined the Corps, Douglas Berneville-Claye, pissed off to Australia at its conclusion, joining hundreds of other former Nazis in Pig Iron Bob‘s safe-haven in the Pacific. Speaking of which, one of the accused, Perth resident Charles Zentai, 84, who allegedly tortured and murdered a Jewish teenager in Budapest, is one step closer to Hungary after having had his appeal against an extradition order dismissed in court on May 29 (‘Alleged Hungarian war criminal moving closer to extradition from Australia’, The Associated Press, International Herald Tribune, May 30, 2007). And while many Nazis were warmly welcomed to this Great Southern Land, many anti-fascists were not so fortunate. Among them was the Italian anarchist Francesco Fantin (1901–1942). He was assassinated by Fascists inside Loveday prison camp in South Australia on November 16, 1942.
…Too late is understood all the evil which fascism, squadrists of a hundred armed men against one, was doing, that immense decimation within that native land, step-mother who denies bread and liberty to her children.
That decimation which they have continued in the country-sides of other people who were friends.
How many huge herds of corpses today are stretched under the light shelter of the red earth.
And what if all these dead were no more than a first installment of the universal destruction, they go on to kill and be killed.
I ask myself! What is the bottom of the wicked nature of these dictators?
Patched and bastard stuff, unstable and, passing leaves, ill-come abortions who lie down in evil as a suckling child involved in his urine, as a drunkard falling senseless in his own vomit, as one ulcerous lying in his pus.
When one says fascism one says horror, its crimes are known. Its infamies do not allow of attenuation. It is a tyranny which tries not without success in many parts of the world — to annul the civilised conquests which were attained during centuries of struggles and of progress in order to push back the human race into a state of shameful barbarism…
~ Francesco Fantin, Pensieri a Ricordi, Loveday Camp, Barmera, 1942.
Keep on keeping on against the Bonehead scum that stand for nothing but cowardice.
When you think of the Australian blood given in the fight against Fascism in WW2 it must have old soldiers turning in their graves at the site of Neo Nazi scum playing gigs in your town.
Always stand firm against this threat.
FUCK FASCISM.
Roddy.
What you guys havent researched correctly is that the only reason this show is on at the Birmy is because no venue in your city would help us and give a venue for 6 new hardcore bands to play, the guys at the Birmy on the other hand were cool to giving us a room without giving a fuck about any of the bands scene status or political stance which i will tell you all on this page NONE OF THE BANDS ON THIS BILL ARE NAZI BANDS and jesus Andy if selling 6-8 nazi titles on my website puts me in the forefront of one of the leading sellers of nazi music in this country mate you have a long long way to go to having any clue but keep up the good work… i admire your interest…
i sell music not politics im afraid
jay
jay,
yeah: the birmy’s desperate, and will book anyone. if it was a popular venue, you’d be at the back of the queue, just like you are with all the other venues.
it’s called economics.
selling half-a-dozen or so titles by neo-nazis DOES put you at the forefront of neo-nazi muzak distros in australia — everybody else has got more sense. and if there are other distros that sell the shit, feel free to name them.
“Niggers, Jews and Communists
Look out scum, you’re on our list”
nice one mate, nice one.
So what you mean, Jay, is that when you sell Nazi propaganda this doesn’t count as ‘politics’ because your interest is solely in making money? Or are such racist threats put to music just so good you couldn’t resist?
Snapshot records:
Blood red eagle… return to asgard… great viking rock from this aussie band fucking tough… $15
fucking dumb!
fucking douglas fucking schott from fucking newcastle!
haha back of the queue. i been playing and booking shows in your city for a long long time and i bet you have been at a few, the only reason were at the back of the queue on this one is that its 6 fresh brand new bands that have never played out of their home towns before let alone someone elses city. come check them out instead of bagging them… support these bands that will have the guts to stand up in the birmy and still do their shit… you may be surprised…
anyway ive had enough fun on this site and wont be back. if anyone would like to talk further on the matter add me on jasonmark69[at]hotmail[dot]com on msn and ill gladly talk more on the matter… im in melbourne every second week for work so in person would be even better… keep on doing what you do best andy, slagging people off without really finding out the total facts… its funny in my youth i was such a commie crusader but i know now why i hung my balaclava up…
oh and the relation to Darren from CW… over the years we have spent many a good time in a balaclava but like i said mines been hung up…
judge me all you want from what records i sell, but like the word you used before champ… its economics… doesnt reflect on my character or beliefs one bit… they are something i hold true to myself and dont feel i need to indulge for some ego boosting affair on the internet… cheers mate it was fun… add me lets chat itll be a blast
“the only reason we’re at the back of the queue on this one is that it’s 6 fresh brand new bands that have never played out of their home towns before let alone someone else’s city.”
precisely. i didn’t mean to imply otherwise. meaning: the reason the birmy, unlike the other venues, is in a position to accept six unknowns is ‘cos they’re desperate.
the reputation of the pub stinks.
only out-of-towners don’t know it.
“come check them out instead of bagging them.”
if i’m bagging them, it’s cos they’re playing a racist shithole: i don’t know them from a bar of soap.
“support these bands that will have the guts to stand up in the birmy and still do there shit… you may be surprised…”
i don’t know what you mean. do these bands have guts ‘cos they’re scabbing? or ‘cos they’re playing a racist shithole? having looked, briefly, at the bands on myspace, i gather you think i’d be surprised ‘cos, like, they ‘dislike racists’ or something. but i’ve heard it all before. and saying / singing / shouting something is one thing; doing something is another.
money talk, bullshit walks.
and these bands are playing the birmy.
===
A LOCAL woman who was intimidated and racially abused by a group of men last month will attend a protest against neo-Nazism outside a Fitzroy pub…
Blondien (not her real name) says she was walking alone to her car on Johnston Street the same night when she was surrounded by about seven men. She says the men screamed abuse at her, calling her a black c..t and forcing her to repeat the insults.
“It’s disgusting that people would single out one person and you have to say stuff about your race to get out of it,” Blondien said.
===
“keep on doing what you do best andy, slagging people off without really finding out the total facts.”
if i slag anyone off, they deserve it.
i’ve told no lies, and you’ve disputed no facts.
===
Blood Red Eagle:
Proud supporters of Blood & Honour Australia, the Southern Cross Hammerskins and the NZ Hammerskins, vewy special guests @ The Birmy last September to celebrate the death of Skrewydriver Ian Stuart, and vewy special guests in Wellington this April to celebrate Adolf Hitler’s birtday.
Bound for Glory:
Deadshit, run-of-the-mill racists from the UK, playing RAC.
Fortress:
You know who they are. Funny thing is, scum never played many shows in Melbourne…
“Reject an alien government, don’t recognise their laws
It’s time to close the floodgates, it’s time to shut the door
Repatriate, ship ’em out, send the bastards back
If they don’t fucking like it, it’ll be in body bags
Get out!”
Legion of St.George:
Wankers played gigs in England in 2003 and 2004… to celebrate Adolf Hitler’s birthday.
Retaliator:
*Yawn* ‘We’re not political’. Ha ha ha ha ha — as they say.
Skrewdriver:
Yeah. Right…
Southern Storm:
Niggers, Jews and Communists
Look out scum, you’re on our list
===
YOU SELL THIS SHIT.
“…and if there are other distros that sell the shit, feel free to name them.”
YOU HAVEN’T.
“… its funny in my youth i was such a commie crusader but i know now why i hung my balaclava up…
i’ve never been a commie crusader. and you don’t have to be one to hate fascism.
“judge me all you want from what records i sell, but like the word you used before champ… its economics… doesnt reflect on my character or beliefs one bit…”
“When the character of a man is not clear to you, look at his friends.”
~ Japanese proverb
Adolf Hitler’s birtHday.
money talkS, bullshit walks.
Tenth Dan is not playing on friday 22nd @ the birmy.
we did the small tour with the other 5 bands but in n.s.w we did not play the friday at the basement.This week we will not be playing the friday at the birmy.
we will be playing the barwon club in geelong on the 23rd
we will be playing the arthouse in melbourne on the 24th
so come on down.Plus check our myspace for other dates cheers choppaz from tenth dan.
I have spoken to members of speartackle and they too have decided that they will not be playing this show.
So i would like it if you were to cancel them from the list.
The other bands on the lineup have been notified and there decision will be made today but i believe that the show will be cancelled.I will inform you of the outcome.
choppaz from tenth dan.
Show has been cancelled choppaz
Yes its true all six bands today came to the conclusion that we would be better off not playing this show due to the attached stigma certain people have put on the venue. All we wanted was a show. None of the bands wanted to or needed to become a pawn in some ones little political game but it happened.
Its a shame now that there are 6 bands on a tour with no venue to play but im sure with the fuel Andy got to boost his ego thats the last of his worries.
I feel it was a simple case of using the 6 bands in his little personal vendetta against the venue… (come on Andy admit it even a little bit).
Andy why dont you go down there when one of these nazi gigs is on and do something about an actual nazi show [rather] than worry about other poor cunts from out of town looking for a show.
You may have stopped a harmless hardcore show from going on here but you havent done anything really except talked a lot about stopping any of these nazi shows that apparently go on at the Birmy. How about a bit of action my son. Get your hand off your cock and get out from in front of the internet and go stop this shit. And i dont mean a protest out the front when the only people in the pub are a couple of the local aborigines having a drink. If youre gonna talk shit about things back the fucker up. You putting a blog site up or putting a stupid stop nazis sticker on a telegraph pole aint gonna do shit. Fuck ive done more than you to stop nazis in my area back in the day. Its always the cunts with the bigger poses that do the fucking least. And its funny cause today i found out who you are. We have even chatted before.
Personally this has been a nightmare and a waste of everyones time. I dont give a flying fuck about anyones political beliefs. Andy youre a white anglo male. You dont have a worry in the world mate. Trust me.
Research mate its all in the research.
And thanks for pointing out i sold nazi records. I forgot about that. Its been a while since i got that box out. Lucky for me this has been a great free advertisement and whatever i havent sold after this week will be removed from my site. And listen if you ever need my home address or full name or phone number just ask mate i have nothing to hide. Its just so child-like on the computer. I dont feel good about this, id rather face to face. But yeah you dont seem to be too keen on that but hey, what was i to expect.
Good luck on your crusade i hope [it] [fulfills] your needs.
Hey dude. Lloyd here from Speartackle. I personally (and i’m sure i speak on behalf of the band) really appreciate you letting us know this history on the venue. None of us support racism and there is no way we want to support a venue that is supporting racism.
Thanks.
Hola Lloyd,
Thanks for doing the right thing.
G’day Jay,
*sigh*
Where to begin? At the start I guess:
“anyway ive had enough fun on this site and wont be back.”
Fibber!
“Yes its true all six bands today came to the conclusion that we would be better off not playing this show due to the attached stigma certain people have put on the venue. All we wanted was a show. None of the bands wanted to or needed to become a pawn in some ones little political game but it happened.”
Jay I share your anger: the manner in which neo-Nazi scum attempt to infiltrate the music industry as a means by which to recruit white youth to their filthy ideology is indeed appalling, and punk and hardcore music will never be reduced to being another pawn in their stupid fascist games. Fighting such manoeuvres has a long and worthy history however, and involves bands too numerous to mention. So I’ll just reference one: Napalm Death.
===
Interviewer : What do you think those who care about this issue should do?
Barney : I would say boycott, boycott, boycott. Don’t buy the fUCKing records. Just leave it alone.
These guys have got an agenda. Some of them don’t know what they are talking about. Some of these white power black metal bands are just stupid kids spreading poison, which is dangerous enough in itself. But there are certain bands where you don’t know that their proceeds isn’t going to funding maybe mailers [direct mailings – ed], or maybe worse.
You know Resistance Records, which is one of the more well-known ones. We were at Milwaukee Metalfest a few years ago and they had a store there. And it was like, what the hell was this? There were white power kids blatantly walking around and giving me the evils, you know, obviously, trying to provoke me.
This goes to promoters too. Hell, you make enough money. Show some integrity. Stop these people from coming in and infesting the scene. If you think it is any good for the scene, then think again. It is just going to cause all kinds of problems.
===
http://slackbastard.anarchobase.com/?p=36
What’s worse, of course, as Barney suggests, is the way in which unscrupulous club and pub owners and promoters — by putting their own desire to make money above all else — facilitate this project of fascist infiltration. On the bright side, one of the effects of the decision by the bands you promote to cancel the gig will be to further reinforce the message that the promotion of fascism and racial hatred will NOT be tolerated in the hardcore / punk scene, and that those unscrupulous club and pub owners who attempt to make money from such expressions of hatred and male dominance WILL be penalised.
“Its a shame now that there are 6 bands on a tour with no venue to play but im sure with the fuel Andy got to boost his ego thats the last of his worries.”
It is a shame. But again, on the bright side, there’s always The Arty on Sunday. Further, the publicity surrounding the cancellation may alert other bands to the boycott, and thus avert the same mistake being repeated. And as Roddy Moreno puts it, I guess it’s really just a matter of:
“Keep on keeping on against the Bonehead scum that stand for nothing but cowardice. When you think of the Australian blood given in the fight against Fascism in WW2 it must have old soldiers turning in their graves at the sight of Neo Nazi scum playing gigs in your town. Always stand firm against this threat. FUCK FASCISM.”
As for your remarks about the cancellation fuelling my ego… well, it’s certainly possible that the bands decided to cancel the gig out of concern for the health of my self-regard, but I kinda doubt it. Instead, I’m prepared to take them on their word, and that is: the bands agree that fascist venues should not be supported — at least not by them. In any case, in truth, I think your repeated remarks about my ‘ego’ are merely a case of projection: you project onto me your own motivations in taking part in public discussions / your public role as the bloke behind Snapshot / the singer with some punk band or other. I think this also applies to your adoption of Class War imagery and politics: while it’s “cool”, you’re happy to be associated with it; when it’s not, you let it drop.
Sorry, but I’m just not like that. If I wanted to be popular, I’d simply follow the herd.
“Andy why dont you go down there when one of these nazi gigs is on and do something about an actual nazi show [rather] than worry about other poor cunts from out of town looking for a show.”
I’ve already addressed the question of ‘why a boycott’, and it appears that the bands, if not their promoter, agree with me, so I won’t go over territory that I’ve already gone over elsewhere, many times. (Those who are interested may search my blog.)
As for my attending a neo-Nazi gig: as you well know, these are not publicly-advertised. Instead, they take place in relative ‘secret’, and the actual location of the gig is only revealed on the day of its occurrence — and then only to a very small group of people. In other parts of the world, secrecy is usually accomplished by first establishing a re-direction point. That is, those with a desire to attend the gig are first directed to one place, whereupon, if they appear to be legitimate gig-goers and meet with the approval of the organisers, they are then given instructions on how to reach the actual venue. In other words, and in short, there is a vetting process.
As for Melbourne, the location of last year’s event, as well as previous events, was discovered through the enactment of an elaborate ceremony involving an ink of pure & genuine saffron mixed with rose-water (with the addition of some blood from a black rooster); one conducted in a quiet room furnished with an altar, a pen with an iron nib, 7 black candles, an incense burner, & some benzoin…
Beyond that, I’m not at liberty to say.
“You may have stopped a harmless hardcore show from going on here but you havent done anything really except talked a lot about stopping any of these nazi shows that apparently go on at The Birmy. How about a bit of action my son. Get your hand off your cock and get out from in front of the internet and go stop this shit. And i dont mean a protest out the front when the only people in the pub are a couple of the local aborigines having a drink. If youre gonna talk shit about things back the fucker up. You putting a blog site up or putting a stupid stop nazis sticker on a telegraph pole aint gonna do shit. Fuck ive done more than you to stop nazis in my area back in the day. Its always the cunts with the bigger poses that do the fucking least. And its funny cause today i found out who you are. We have even chatted before.”
Sheesh. A bloke who makes money from peddling Blood Red Eagle, Bound For Glory, Fortress, Legion of St. George, Retaliator, Skrewdriver and Southern Storm wants to lecture ME on doing my bit for the class war?
You don’t know me from a bar of soap, and have absolutely no idea what I have or haven’t done to disrupt local fascist organising — and that’s fine by me. I’m more than happy to let others resort to juvenile proclamations of their manliness, whether it’s in regards to fighting fascism, drinking piss, or just… y’know… being manly? So my message to you is this: Grow up Jay. I’m not a child. And neither, presumably, are you.
“Personally this has been a nightmare and a waste of everyones time. I dont give a flying fuck about anyones political beliefs. Andy youre a white anglo male. You dont have a worry in the world mate. Trust me.”
Uh-huh… um, so why do I keep getting death threats from people who like to listen to bands like Blood Red Eagle, Bound For Glory, Fortress, Legion of St. George, Retaliator, Skrewdriver and Southern Storm? I mean shit, I’ve told them I’m white, but they just don’t seem to care!
“Research mate its all in the research.”
And development.
By the way, when are you going to remove the Class War logo from your site?
haha hope you got your dose of doing your bit for the class war today hahaha… that ego of yours must be grand, like i said you can jerk off all you want all you did was stop 6 bands have a show and 3 of them are full-on anti fascist bands… i dont see you stopping any nazi shows soft cock hahaha keep on jerking off…
nah the logo will stay ill remove the records instead…that make you feel better…???
the 6 bands miss out on their show and no nazis have been harmed in the process… WEAK.
but i gotta say Andy you are giving me mega enjoyment for the 5 mins i have spare every day to come to this site…
It’s Official.
You’re An Idiot.
jesus took you long enough to work that out… youre not so quick yourself are you james…
Er thanks Arthur… or was that Martha?
Oh yeah.
“Personally this has been a nightmare and a waste of everyone’s time.”
Speaking of which:
“Sitting in a pub with their race hate on display
Trying to figure out who they’re gonna hate today
Better watch their backs, we’re gonna come for them one day
We’re gonna wreck their Nazi nightmare
Now they’re on the streets, they’re filled with hate
Gonna stop ‘em now, you know tomorrow’s gonna be too late
Gonna stop ‘em now, gonna end this fascist hate
We’re gonna wreck their Nazi nightmare
Gotta understand they don’t care about what they do
They’re coming through that door, coming after me and you
Coming through that door, but now we know what to do…
We’re gonna wreck their Nazi nightmare”
– ‘Nazi Nightmare’, The Oppressed (1994)
yeah roddy actually went out on the streets and fought them. he didnt sit back on his p.c. and quote himself and feel hes making any sort of change.
youre just annoying people that arent nazis but have no interest in your bullshit politics.
with all your great research skills, you should know how to find the real nazis. so go find them and smash them nazis. but you wont, youre all talk, not even that, youre all quotes. cant even think of anything on your own, just spew out all leftist bullshit you hear, [maybe] youll sound intelligent… pretty typical of you fuckwits with too much time on your hands.
youve done nothing to further your cause.
hola ‘faggot anachist’.
what have you got against the letter ‘r’?
roddy’s done lots of stuff. one of the things he (and his band, and the band’s fans) did was decide not to tolerate racist dickheads at gigs. he also encouraged other skinheads to take a stand against bonehead infiltration through the simple device of declaring events as being sponsored and/or supported by s h a r p: skinheads against racial prejudice. both roddy and others who did this kind of thing came in for all sorts of criticism, but being grown-ups, it didn’t stop them.
as for my degree of intelligence, it’s a mark of your own stupidity to think that i care what you think. in any case, i’m reasonably confident that anyone reading this blog, and comparing its contents to your own commentary on it, would conclude that — between the two of us — i’m probably *not* the one in dire need of classes in remedial english.
cheers,
andy.
get fucked poof…
Does this mean I’m not invited to your birthday party?
lol, keep up the good work @ndy; great blog mate.
Condemned 84, Combat 84, Crashed Out, Retaliator, Tattooed Motherfuckers and Unit Lost are not Nazis where did you get your info on them from? I can see that some people may consider Retaliator fascist but where the fuck did you get Crashed Out being Nazis from? I’ve never read a more ill-informed list in my life.
Dear Noisy,
So I take it that you’d agree that:
Antagon;
Battle Scarred;
D.A.;
Get Out;
The Gits;
Hateful;
Kampfzone;
Knockdown;
and Marching On are all examples of fascist / neo-Nazi / RAC and/or white power muzak?
As for Condemned 84, Combat 84, Crashed Out, Retaliator, Tattooed Motherfuckers and Unit Lost…
In addition to the daft lyrics, posturing on stage, and bad company etcetera, etcetera, etcetera:
1) Condemned 84: Tired of pretending otherwise, the band finally hopped off the fence in 2001 at the GMM Beer Olympics, when according to organisers they “opted not to perform due to the fact that two bands who have African-American members would be performing on the same stage.”
2) Combat 84: The band was formed by Chris Henderson, who also helped form the Chelsea Headhunters, and took over the reins from another neo-Nazi activist Steve Hickmott. Over the years, Hickmott, Chubby and the Headhunters developed close working relations with a range of groups on the far right, including C18 (before it imploded) and a number of Loyalist groups.
3) TMF: Duh, I wonder why they don’t use their real names… and why is the band schedule to play with ULTIMA THULE in August among others? An attempt by Steve “Jonesy” Jones of English Rose to go straight.
As for Crashed Out and Unit Lost, I don’t remember now why they’re listed, but I think in the case of the latter it’s ‘cos that’s what someone from their hometown told me… I’ll check again on both.
So at this stage I guess that’s a measly 13 out of 15 fascist / neo-Nazi / RAC and/or white power muzak bands Fiona sells.
What a lot of shit.
Firstly, your scribblings about Chubby Chris and Steve Hickmott are utter rubbish. Yes Chubby was a Chelsea Headhunter, so was Steve. Doesnt make them nazis however.
Not to say that there werent (or arent) nazis involved in the Headhunters, the same goes for most of Europes football firms. Incidentally, the two of them own a bar in Pattaya, Thailand, called The Dogs Bollocks. Further information, from the horses mouth, can be obtained by reading Steve Hickmotts book Armed for the match, and Chubbys book Who wants it?, both well worth a read.
Secondly, Ive heard the story of Condemned 84 refusing to play the Beer Olympics because the Templars were playing many times, most often from ill informed fuckwits like yourself, who hear these rumors and then run with them, so I decided to find out for myself what ACTUALLY went on. So I contacted Kev from Condemned and asked him. Turned out the organizers of the said festival had invited Condemned to play, then refused to pay for their airfares, to which Condemned told them to shove the festival up their arses. The organizers, not wanting to lose face, and probably because Condemned had a reputation as being right wing, concocted the story so many imbeciles like yourself happily thrive on. If you dont believe me email Kev yourself and get the facts.
As for TMF, well I think everybody knows who Jonesy is, so enough said.
Some of the bands on your list I’ve not heard much about but well done for being able to trot out a list of them. I don’t think that The Gits are dodgy though but I may be wrong as again I don’t know much about them.
The Condemned 84 story is one that gets trotted out now and then and I’m afraid that it is bollocks. Condemned 84 have played on the same bill as bands with black members a good number of times (the second?? Holidays in the Sun being an example). Recently they played a gig here somewhere up north where they made it clear in big letters on the posters that anyone displaying any (Left or Right) political symbols would not be welcome and refused admission.
On the Unit Lost myspace page they have the legend Love Music Hate Fascism on it which I think says enough on their stand point.
Daft lyrics, posturing on stage does not make anyone a far right lunatic, a lot of bands from all manner of musical styles are guilty of that, as for dodgy company the early 2 tone bands had far right followers even though a lot of them had members from different racial backgrounds, it doesn’t make them racists it just means that the far right music fans are idiots that can’t back up their own one dimensional world view when it comes to reality.
You still haven’t said why Retaliator are on there either. I think that you listing bands and claiming that they are without question nazis does nothing to further the cause of anti fascism and shows that there really is a lack of research and a reliance on rumour and gossip.
Re Condemned 84:
I read about their supposed refusal to play the Beer Olympics on OPP. I wrote Darryl for more info. He reckons it may have been the result of a dispute b/w the band and the promoter. Another short account citing a GMM press release is avail here:
http://www.buildingdemocracy.org/White_Nationalist_Activity/National/Condemned_84_Refuse_To_Play_Beer_Olympics_20041225568/
Roddy Moreno reckons C84 and Section 5 are two bands he’s regretted working with ‘cos they’re happy to lie down with dogs. Until I hear more from friends in the UK, I think their politics can be safely classified as reactionary and right-wing, if not fascist, while the extent of their racism remains unknown.
Re Chubby ‘Shit, is that the ‘RA?’ Chris:
No, in and of itself, being a member of the Chelsea Headhunters does not make someone a neo-Nazi. On the other hand, it greatly increases their chances. As for football firms and politics, yeah of course it varies. But again, some firms have reputations, and in the case of the Headhunters, well-earnt reputations.
===
According to the book “Spirit of ’69” Chubby Chris from Combat 84 was a one-time organizer for the British Movement. The British Movement was a racist organization that wanted to expel all Asians and Blacks from Britain. That makes him a racist (though it is true he later moved to Thailand and probably renounced his ways). Saying he was never racist is like saying an organizer for White Aryan Resistance was not a racist. It ain’t possible.
Also, in the half-hour documentary on Combat 84 filmed by the BBC a big brawl breaks out between skinheads from London and a mob from Harlow. A member of Combat 84 (probably Chubby Chris) is heard to say “Why are you fighting? We’re all white!”. That statement is pretty self-explanatory. We doubt you would have seen many non-white skinheads at a Combat 84 show in the early 80’s, no matter what some people like to believe.
http://insurgence.proboards24.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=print&thread=1125592867
===
Noisy Bastard writes:
“Daft lyrics, posturing on stage does not make anyone a far right lunatic, a lot of bands from all manner of musical styles are guilty of that, as for dodgy company the early 2 tone bands had far right followers even though a lot of them had members from different racial backgrounds, it doesn’t make them racists it just means that the far right music fans are idiots that can’t back up their own one dimensional world view when it comes to reality.”
By ‘daft lyrics’ and ‘posturing’ I mean nationalistic machismo and xenophobia. And I’m well aware of the fact that individuals can love music made by people from groups that they despise. As you state, that’s ‘cos they’ve got shit-for-brains.
In your first post you wrote:
“Condemned 84, Combat 84, Crashed Out, Retaliator, Tattooed Motherfuckers and Unit Lost are not Nazis where did you get your info on them from? I can see that some people may consider Retaliator fascist but where the fuck did you get Crashed Out being Nazis from? I’ve never read a more ill-informed list in my life.”
You haven’t read many lists then.
As it stands, the only bones of contention are Crashed Out, Retaliator and Unit Lost; three bands out of a list of 15 for sale by a local bonehead distro. Note that I described the bands not simply as ‘Nazi’, but as belonging to a range of “fascist / neo-Nazi / RAC and white power” viewpoints. It’s possible to be a racist and/or a fascist without being a neo-Nazi…
More later.
loudproudpunk,
i used to work with a bloke who’s a former member of the national front. despite the fact that he’s married to a thai women, he was quick to inform me that the perth government granted the ‘boongs’ the right to take over the city yonks ago. he also told me that one of his skinhead mates, who has two st. george’s crosses tattooed on his neck, can’t figure out why his thai girlfriend feels offended when he calls her a nigger. nevertheless, why do Chubby Chris and Steve Hickmott own a bar in pattaya, thailand? i guess they (like a few other pride-strength-honour lads) didn’t know that the majority of bars in pattaya have made the city popular for budget-conscious tourists, mainly white males, who enjoy the sex trade.
–ss spandexxx
@ndy whats your point? I said that I didnt see what bands like Crashed Out had done to be included on this ill-informed rumour-based list. I have spoken to members of Crashed Out, Retaliator and Unit Lost since I found this page and if I without very much effort can show that there are important factual errors in it then why should I accept anything else on it? As I said it is an ill-informed list based on rumour. If you are going to name names make sure that there is proper proof to the claims that are made otherwise you look like a fucking idiot. Admitting that you can’t remember why a band was mentioned makes you look like a twat. Oh and by the way I have read hundreds of lists about fascist bands over the years but never one so badly researched and plainly amateurish. As I said before, Unit Lost have the Love Music Hate Fascism legend on their myspace page which I think is enough to show where their politics lie and again show me that Retaliator are Nazis/ Fascist/ RAC I still see no proof only shitty fucking rumour. And I have asked various other anti-Nazi types before. All you are providing is rumour and gossip, and fuck all fact. Forget the other bands on the list, they are all well-known. I want you to show me your proof about the bands I’ve mentioned. Oh and just in case you didn’t know there is a far-right band called Retaliator but they are a totally different band and studio-based and as far as I know defunct. We are on the same side I just hate it when disinformation becomes fact. And stop pretending you are an authority on far-right bands when it’s fucking obvious that you are far from it.
Noisy,
1)
I’m making a number of points, in case you hadn’t noticed. As regards this post, the main point I’m making has to do with the extent of racist and fascist infiltration of local hardcore punk by way of: a) The Birmingham Hotel; b) Deadset Music and; c) Snapshot Records. Thus: The Birmy has for years hosted gigs organised by Blood & Honour Australia and the Southern X Hammerskins. Deadset Music is an online distro run by a local bonehead called Fiona, who is good friends with those involved in local bonehead networks, was in attendance at last year’s ISD memorial gig, and who sells muzak by the list of bands whose political perspective you so strongly question. Finally, Snapshot Records is a Sydney-based hardcore label and distro run by Jay, which in addition to flogging neo-Nazi muzak, also claims affiliation to Class War! (This latter fact has been raised with both Jay and Class War repeatedly, but as yet no action has been taken.)
More generally, inre to the political commitments of oi! and skinhead bands in particular, the milieu is often characterised, unfortunately, by a remarkable degree of dishonesty and sleaziness. To take one prominent, local, example: Melbourne (x-Canberra) band Bulldog Spirit. According to the singer, Doug Smith, BS is ‘apolitical’, and its members are ordinary, decent, hard-working, working-class blokes tryin’ to make their way in this crazy ol’ world of ours while havin’ a laugh and havin’ a say… etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. As Doug himself has written:
===
“I think by continually mentioning me in the context of Blood and Honour and Hammerskin activity in your blogs [sic] that you are trying to infer to your readers that I am affiliated with these movements. I am not.
As previously stated on your blog, I am not a part of any movement and I don’t subscribe to any political theory be it left or right…
Left wing, right wing, I ain’t no angel
I’m just an ordinary man
I’m not the best, but I’m not the worst
I’m just doing the best that I can…”
===
In short, BS revolves around the usual cliches one often associates with oi! music, which mistake the cultural proclivities of young, straight, white ‘working class’ blokes with working-class culture as a whole. What’s interesting about the band — and what reveals a little more about its actual composition — is its history, that of its members, and the extremely close relationship (a la Fiona Deadset) between the band and local boneheads. For example, consider the drummer, Joel. According to Damien Ovchynik, the singer for local neo-Nazi band Bail Up!:
===
“Bail Up! formed in 2000, I think it was, out of a small scene in Canberra. Sid from Fortress was living up there with us for a bit and was a big part in getting the ball rolling. Myself and Rodney were [basically] the band for a long time, writing all the material and using lads here and there for recordings and gigs. A big cheers to Shannon and Joel from Ravenous!”
===
Joel has also played drums for other, local neo-Nazi bands, Death’s Head and Ravenous. Or again, in its original line-up, local ‘working class punk band’ (sic) Marching Orders included a bloke called Mick on guitar, who also played in Bail Up! Mind you, none of these facts are promoted by the bands or its members, for obvious reasons. And while the list could go on, I won’t add to it: I’d rather see the inevitable denials first.
As for a person’s working class credentials — and being ‘working class’ is obviously *de rigeur* for oi! bands — ironically enough, one of the blokes from the Dropkick Murphys once said (in response to the question “How do you define working-class? What does it mean to be a working-class rock band?”):
===
“I don’t know, it’s just how I was raised. I don’t offer a fancy definition of working class. But it’s something you’re born into. I have friends who have gone on to college and got great white collar jobs, but they’ll always be working class kids. By the same token, there are kids from rich families who move to a new city where nobody knows them, shave their head, get a job at a factory and go around talking about working class this and that; but they’ll never be. As far as we go as a band, working class rock band just signifies that we came from nothing.”
===
In summary, then, I don’t take bands at face value; the milieu has long been marked by political controversy; in addition, there are real pressures on bands to downplay or to distort their real political commitments in order to avoid ‘trouble’, whether from police and state authorities or from skinheads themselves. (One example of this is the situation of German boneheads.) Further, these questions are raised in a context in which ‘skinhead’ is often thought to be synonymous with ‘bonehead’, and oi! music, by definition, is almost always played by racist scum. That this isn’t true, and never has been, is obvious — at least for those who care to look. At the same time, the reason for the emergence of this situation is, at least in part, because of the failure of skinheads to purge the subculture of racist, fascist, and neo-Nazi elements. In other words, because of a reluctance to take an uncompromising stance towards the scum who would like to use skinhead and oi! to further their own reactionary, profoundly *anti*-working class political agendas. That said, I have a great deal more respect for the boneheads who are ‘out and proud’ than I do for the sleazy cunts who hide behind claims of being ‘apolitical’ — while at the same time being happy to sleep in the same bed.
2)
“I have spoken to members of Crashed Out, Retaliator and Unit Lost since I found this page and if I without very much effort can show that there are important factual errors in it then why should I accept anything else on it?”
I’ve got absolutely no idea who you are, what you’ve done, or what you want, apart from to dispute the allegation — initially at least — that Condemned 84, Combat 84, Crashed Out, Retaliator, Tattooed Motherfuckers and Unit Lost are “Nazis”. (You now appear to have conceded that Condemned 84, Combat 84 and Tattooed Motherfuckers, at least, are likely what I stated: exponents of fascist / neo-Nazi / RAC and/or white power music.)
You haven’t pointed out ANY important factual errors. Name one!
As for Crashed Out, according to TWAFA – Tyne and Wear Anti Fascist Association, in an article titled ‘Nazi Music’:
“Clubs and pubs local to the North East provide venues for nazi groups. In March 1998, Crashed Out played at Rockshots in Newcastle. The band then played an April St. George’s Day gig at the On Cue snooker hall in Jarrow that attracted nazi boneheads from throughout the UK.”
http://www.twafa.org.uk/2004/02/10/nazi-music/
Crashed Out is also distroed by Micetrap:
http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?pid=1049
Still, I’m waiting on some info from compas in the UK. And if I’m wrong, I’d be only too happy to acknowledge my mistake: one less mob of boneheads is a good thing.
3)
On Retaliator, I dunno what you’re talking about, but the one I refer to is the one for sale on the Deadset site. They recorded a split with Polish boneheads The Gits on ‘Strong Survive’ Records (2004), a neo-Nazi label. Also for sale on Deadshit are ‘When Duty Calls’ (2005) on Belgian label Pure Impact and and ‘Beyond the Cold Light of Day’ (ASA Productions, 2007). Pure Impact was launched by Belgian neo-Nazis Peter Swillen, Ludo Henri Crol and Luc Taymansrun in conjunction with the good fascist Herbert Egoldt, the corrupt businessman who formerly operated Rock-o-Rama.
4)
On Unit Lost, being from Eskilstuna, Sweden makes it a little difficult for someone from Melbourne, Australia to assess… but as with the UK, I have contacts, and will see what else I can dig up. On the other hand, like Crashed Out, Unit Lost is distroed by Micetrap, as well as Pure Impact and nsm88. They also released ‘Headliners or Work’ on German RAC label Dim Records, established by Ullrich Grossman, as well as a split with Battle Scarred, another ‘RAC’ band. As for the label on their site… *duh*. That’s new, and to the less naive, a fairly obvious attempt to avoid being censored — especially on myspace, which apparently has a policy of not hosting racist pages. Try searching for Bail Up! and you’ll see what I mean.
5)
Your insults are tedious.
Cheers,
@ndy.
You started it with the insults, you self-righteous prick. Im off now as Ive better things to do.
No, I didn’t, as anyone who can read will soon discover.
But as you seem to be asking for it, here’s one:
You’re just like the English cricket team.
Shit.
@ndy
Jun 12th, 2007 at 8:03 pm
LOL it sounds like hes broken your heart or something… Do you two have a personal history together?
He broke my heart and he made me cry
He said that I couldn’t dance
But now I’m back to let him know
That I can really make romance
“Andy is straight in San Francisco, white in South Africa, an European in Europe.”
Um… good for Andy?!?
Speaking of fascist bands and secret gigs, I’m not sure that they’re so secret any more…
A few years ago I went to a gig with two mates of mine from Bangladesh, one of whom was over for a few weeks and wanted to check out the local metal scene. Not being that clued in to metal world I took him to a gig headlined by Destroyer 666, at which Gospel of the Horns also played – it was a Saturday night at the Hi-Fi Bar in Swanston Street in the city.
We noticed a large contingent of fairly serious looking neo-Nazis building up in one corner of the Hi-Fi-Bar: white women with bicep tatts of Hitler, lots of swastikas tattooed onto skulls etc. By the time Gospel of the Horns went on, this entire contingent of about 20 of them were down the front dancing away. When they finished, they came up to me and my two mates, gave us a lovely heil Hitler salute and took our photo. Needless to say, we ran away.
What was most interesting to me about this experience was that no-one else in the venue, including lefty punks that I know from other parts of my world, seemed to either notice or give a shit. A bit depressing really.
Oh yeah — and then a couple of yr mates told me that I was silly for thinking Gospel of the Horns hang out with Nazi types. I would have asked for a copy of the photo if I wasn’t a little bit worried about getting the shit beaten out of me…
“What was most interesting to me about this experience was that no-one else in the venue, including lefty punks that I know from other parts of my world, seemed to either notice or give a shit. A bit depressing really.
Oh yeah — and then a couple of yr mates told me that I was silly for thinking Gospel of the Horns hang out with Nazi types. I would have asked for a copy of the photo if I wasn’t a little bit worried about getting the shit beaten out of me… ”
Dunno who yr referring to by way of my lefty punk mates, but it’s certainly true that the band has recently disavowed support for racism or fascism… well, privately at least… and only after realising that not doing so may harm their ability to shift units / play live at certain venues…
Same old story.
===
TARTAREAN DESIRE WEBZINE, July 2003, i/view with a relatively short barreled piece of artillery:
“You seem to know a lot about your home nation of Australia. Would you consider yourself to be a patriotic citizen?”
Oh, most definitely. I’m very proud of my country and of my heritage… I think it is important to be aware of your past and to have pride in ones’ own identity. Once you lose your sense of self (identity), you then lose all sense of direction… Stand your ground, and don’t be ashamed of what you are… There are far too many individuals in my country who are falling to the wayside, almost giving up in a sense. It almost feels like we Australians are losing our core traditional ideals and becoming engulfed by today’s multi-culturalism and mass immigration.
“As a fellow member of the British Commonwealth, what do you think about the state of this organization these days?”
Unfortunately, if you look at the history of the British Empire and its’ colonies, they have in one regard rid themselves of their responsibilities. Palestine, Zimbabwe and Hong Kong are all examples of this. Here once more is an example of a country which is losing its sense of historic identity. It’s rather sad and ironic that Great Britain fought to rid the world of Nazi Germany, but in return had to sell off much of its’ empire, and also hand over its status of true world power to the USA to gain this victory. Personally, I don’t think it will be too long before Australia becomes a republic and unleashes herself from the monarchy.
===
Afaik, the racist and fascist views of bands like D666 and GotH are fairly well-known among local and international metalheads, and those who refuse to acknowledge their politics are invariably either ignorant, naive, stupid and/or lying; what varies is how much any actually give a shit, a position not unrelated to the fact that the boys in question are almost all white — and therefore, until and unless they express a contrary view — they’re ‘alright’. The x-over b/w metal, esp death metal, and various forms of neo-Nazism (NS) began many years ago, and the local (Australian) kkkrew have been pissing in one another’s pockets for only a slightly shorter length of time. Like elements in the local oi and hardcore milieu, it can be a remarkably dishonest and sleazy affair, but basically in this instance, we’re talking about a racist bunch of white blokes in their mid-30s, many of whom have skeletons in the closet.
See also : http://slackbastard.anarchobase.com/?p=667
Well, I suppose that kind of answers my grumble.
I was pretty amazed to see such seriously kitted out Nazi crew at an openly organised gig in the city. And that I approached a few lefty punks at the gig itself (including the mixer) and asked them what they thought the deal was — they suggested that it was nothing to worry about. Which I suppose it wasnt for the whiteys… But the fact that the big group of Nazis – and Im talking 20 people with swastikas and Hitler tatts (not subtle) seemed most interested in Gospel of the Horns (i.e they went and placed themselves the centre of the moshpit for that band specifically) just seems to suggest to me that there may be something suss about them. Their disavowals are pretty fucking meaningless unless they are going to have the guts to tell those types to fuck off and not come to their shows, AT their shows. Many have done it before them…
Anyway — it was actually at a meeting that I called through the familiar anti-Birmy crew in Melbourne that I was told that they werent Nazis. Bah-humbug and bollocks to that.
G’day grumblebum,
Yeah, generally speaking, it’s a rare sight, but you’ll find them at some metal shows (very often ones with GotH on the bill), as well as some punk/hardcore gigs, although usually in groups smaller than 20. And in such circumstances — well, unless they have their political affiliations tattooed on their faces, heads, necks or hands (and some, *a la* Damian Ovchynik, do) — it’s possible for them to travel relatively incognito, dressed in, say, a Condemned 84 t-shirt (or summat similar), rather than, say, a B&H or Skrewdriver one.
Plausible deniability; pride/strength/honour ‘n’ all that malarky.
As for confronting them: first, a group of 20 boneheads is intimidating, and is consciously designed to be, which is precisely why they tend to travel in this manner. Secondly, GotH welcomes kkkrews like this at their gigs with open arms, and always has (after all, they constitute some of the band’s most loyal fans and closest mates). Thirdly, confronting boneheads at a GotH gig is likely to alienate not only the band but many of its fans too, and probably shouldn’t be undertaken unless it’s in an organised fashion: relying on mixers, bouncers, and/or people whose appearance would suggest that they’re ‘left’ is a really bad idea (all kinds of complete fuckwits wear ‘anarchist’ and ‘leftist’ paraphernalia).
With some exceptions, then, the general view in local (death) metal circles is that confronting fascists is simply not “fun”; anything that’s not “fun” is frowned upon; and to do so is to simply “stir up trouble” / “they’re not hurting anyone” / “Holocaust? What Holocaust?” / etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. Bands that do take the trouble to confront racism and fascism, whether in their lyrics or during their performances, tend to be from other islands, places where the consequences for lying down for brownshirts tends to have more immediate consequences. Fortunately, a more combative, less supine attitude is, I think(?), becoming more prevalent within The World of Metal as the cutting edge increasingly shifts away from the relatively pampered and ideologically conservative confines of, say, suburban Melbourne, to the urban centres of the so-called Third World; or in other words, to places where this kind of an elitist, White supremacist racial politic is much less tenable (if not completely unsupportable).
But that, as they say, is another story.
As for GotH, The Boys in the Band are good mates with the boys in B&H, and the involvement of someone like Scott McGuinnness (Fortress / B&H / Southern X Hammerskins) in local muzak parallels, both chronologically and politically, that of many others in the local metal milieu, including those in the Abyssic Hate / D666 / GotH / MIM axis. The owner of MIM, Daniel Janecka, for example, besides being a little rich kid, is also a fascist sympathiser, and his label has provided and continues to provide a home for a number of neo-Nazis with an artistic bent.
Finally, a cautionary note is required in the case of black and death metal, which is that the use of fascist, misogynistic and neo-Nazi imagery and lyrics is just as often used simply for shock value (“Take that Mum, Dad, and all you squares!”) as it constitutes the expression of a serious political commitment. At the same time, this fact should not be used — and it often is — to avoid acknowledging the fact that many are in fact quite serious about their politics and their hatred and contempt for non-Whites, queers, etcetera… or at least as serious as every other schmuck out there in the musickal and political marketplace is!
@ndy.
Good on you…
One question, is Jay Snapshot the old singer from Toe to Toe?
Hope you’ve read No Retreat by Dave Hann and Steve Tilzey?
G’day Rocky,
Yep, read the book. In fact, I’ve also re-published an i/view with Dave which you can find here: http://slackbastard.anarchobase.com/?p=294
As for Jay being the old singer from Toe to Toe… I fucking hope not!
Nah, don’t think so: that’s Scott… I can remember seeing them when they toured Melbourne to promote their first (or was it second?) single back in ’92; I still got it lying around somewhere I think. Godwin knows where their politics are @ nowadays. A lotta hardcore revolves around playing a kinda retarded version of macho man y no mucho más…
In fact, in an exclusive to slackbastard, I’ve just been sent the lyrics to Bulldog Spirit’s new single (a split with Tattooed Motherfuckers or some other band that is IN NO WAY SHAPE OR FORM related to the worship of a dead coprophiliac dicktator).
You read it here first punk folks!
===
Body… wanna feel my body?
Body… such a thrill my body
Body… wanna touch my body?
Body… it’s too much my body
Check it out my body, body
Don’t you doubt my body, body
Talkin’ bout my body, body
Check it out my body
Every man wants to be a macho macho man
To have the kind of body, always in demand
Jogging in the mornings, go man go
Works out in the office gym, muscles glow
You can best believe that, he’s a macho man
Ready to get down with, anyone he can
Hey! Hey! Hey, hey, hey!
Macho, macho man (macho man)
I’ve got to be, a macho man
Macho, macho man
I’ve got to be a macho! Ow…
Macho, macho man
I’ve got to be, a macho man
Macho, macho man (yeah, yeah)
I’ve got to be a macho!
Body, it’s so hot, my body
Body, love to pop my body
Body, love to please my body
Body, don’t you tease my body
Body, you’ll adore my body
Body, come explore my body
Body, made by God, my body
Body, it’s so good, my body
You can tell a macho, he has a funky walk
His Perry shirts and Martens, always look so boss
Funky with his body, he’s a king
Call him Mister Hardcore, dig his wallet-chains
You can best believe that, he’s a macho man
Likes to be the leader, he never dresses grand
Hey! Hey! Hey, hey, hey!
Macho, macho man
I’ve got to be, a macho man
Macho, macho man
I’ve got to be a macho! (all right)
Macho, macho man (yeah, yeah)
I’ve got to be, a macho man
Macho, macho man
I’ve got to be a macho! All right!
Ugh! Macho… baby!
Body, body, body wanna feel my body
Body, body, body gonna thrill my body
Body, body, body don’tcha stop my body
Body, body, body it’s so hot my body
Every man ought to be a macho macho man
To live a life of freedom, machos make a stand
Have their own life style and ideals
Possess the pride strength and honour, life’s a steal
You can best believe that he’s a macho man
He’s a special person in anybody’s land
Hey! Hey! Hey, hey, hey!
Macho, macho man (macho man)
I’ve got to be, a macho man
Macho, macho man
I’ve got to be a macho! (dig the hair on my chest)
Macho, macho man (see my big fat tattoos)
I’ve got to be, a macho man
Macho, macho man
I’ve got to be a macho! (dig broad shoulders)
Macho, macho man (dig my muscles)
I’ve got to be, a macho man
Macho, macho man
I’ve got to be a macho!
Macho, macho man
I’ve got to be, a macho man
Macho, macho man
I’ve got to be a macho! HEY!
The singer of Crashed Out is currently singing with Angelic Upstarts. Crashed Out have also toured/played and recorded with The Templars/Oppressed/Oi Polloi & The Selecter.
This is probably the biggest load of crap I have ever read, ill-researched and typical left-wing slander of anything you might even remotely consider to be a bit more to the right.
Andy, as proof of your claims, you pick bits and pieces from various other anti-fascist websites that are equally ill-informed. That’s not research, that’s called fooling people and repeating rumours. You know the saying, throw enough mud and it’ll stick.
As Jay pointed out, you do absolutely nothing for the anti-fascist cause, you’re an internet warrior. Full stop. If you really want to do something about the “massive” nazi threat (like 100 people in a country of 21,000,000 inhabitants?), take your battle to the street and confront them physically. Oh yeah, I forgot what you wrote earlier “they’re so intimidating”… Coward!
Better go to the gym to work off your frustrations, get a life, there’s a whole world out there and more constructive stuff to do.
G’day Bolshoi & Armin,
Bolshoi:
Here’s what I wrote inre Crashed Out:
===
As for Crashed Out, according to TWAFA – Tyne and Wear Anti Fascist Association, in an article titled ‘Nazi Music’:
“Clubs and pubs local to the North East provide venues for nazi groups. In March 1998, Crashed Out played at Rockshots in Newcastle. The band then played an April St. George’s Day gig at the On Cue snooker hall in Jarrow that attracted nazi boneheads from throughout the UK.”
http://www.twafa.org.uk/2004/02/10/nazi-music/
Crashed Out is also distroed by Micetrap:
http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?pid=1049
Still, I’m waiting on some info from compas in the UK. And if I’m wrong, I’d be only too happy to acknowledge my mistake: one less mob of boneheads is a good thing.
===
1) I still haven’t heard back;
2) I’d like to know what the band feels about being distroed by Micetrap;
3) If it’s true that Crashed Out aren’t boneheads, believe it or not, I’m glad.
Armin:
Your comment bears an uncanny resemblance to the other critics on this thread: big on put-downs, low on information. And like others, you’re far from specific, and contest no facts as they’re presented here.
As for your claim that I’m ‘fooling people and repeating rumours’: nonsense. I report what I find. I also allow you — and anyone else who wants to add their two cents — to do so. What readers make of it all is completely up to them, as it should be.
Finally, as for your incredibly helpful advice on fighting fascism, what I wrote is the following:
“As for confronting them: first, a group of 20 boneheads is intimidating, and is consciously designed to be, which is precisely why they tend to travel in this manner.”
In other words, the question I was addressing was whether or not it’s advisable for a handful of punters to confront a much larger group of boneheads, especially when they’re on the piss, and seem to be keeping to themselves. The scenario Liz described involved her and two of her mates.
Not great odds, really.
As a general rule, the same goes for anyone wanting to confront any much larger group of young men; doubly so if they do so on the basis that their politics are violently oppositional. That is, in such circumstances, my advice is not to.
If that makes me a coward, so be it.
There’s a whole world out there, and it’s worth defending.